# Lawsuits Mount Over Software Used by Landlords to Set Rents
**URL:** https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795
**Category:** General Discussion
**Tags:** rent, realpage
**Created:** [24 July 2024 17:25 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795 "2024-07-24T17:25:41Z")
**Posts on this page:** 15
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Citizen\_bitcoin](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Citizen_bitcoin)
#### Post date: [24 July 2024 17:25 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/1 "2024-07-24T17:25:42Z")
Antitrust cases contend that use of RealPage’s algorithm, which lets property owners share private data, amounts to collusion.
[https://archive.is/pW6WV](https://archive.is/pW6WV)
> [@The Crazy Years](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/the-crazy-years/1451/4174):
>
> From SaaS to CaaS (Cartel as a Service): [[image]](https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/fbi-raids-landlord-tied-to-rent-price-fixing-scandal-in-10-states-including-calif/ar-BB1nYLGC) Shelley Schmidig, a Modesto renter who represents the renters who paid allegedly artificially high rates, accuses RealPage of “cartelization,” stating that “since approximately 2016, this cartel has substantially increased rents (over and beyond what the fair market would support) and inflated profits for the apartment owners while positioning RealPage as the hub of the apartment leasing industry, an indispensable and necessary player in one of…
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### Author:  [@Hypatia](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Hypatia)
#### Post date: [24 July 2024 17:45 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/2 "2024-07-24T17:45:47Z")
I get the old trust-bustin’, price fixin’ legal theories, but OTOH, what do they mean by “what a fair market would support”? For that matter, what do they mean by “fair market” —kinda an oxymoron isn’t it?
I mean on one hand, ALL markets are “unfair” in that they don’t care about the buyers’ needs, just what they will,pay at any given time. On the other, all markets are fair, they’ll eventually sort themselves out to what buyers can bear, or competition will arise and level prices.
It’s very expensive being a landlord these days.
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### Author:  [@Citizen\_bitcoin](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Citizen_bitcoin)
#### Post date: [24 July 2024 17:52 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/3 "2024-07-24T17:52:41Z")
Landlords got screwed during COVID.
Finding a good tenant is not easy. Breaking even is no picnic.
I saw what my mom and dad experienced. Painful experience is the best teacher. After 20 years my dad finally figured out a great system for vetting tenants and managing turnover, breaking even or better, appeasing city and county inspections, insurance underwriting… I get exhausted thinking about what he endured but he created a system that worked for him and no software required except his brain.
Edit:
I don’t know anyone who uses Real Page in California. Maybe property managers who manage 100+ units and multiple buildings but… real estate is not day trading like stocks and derivatives… prospective tenant applies, check credit and rental history, sign lease, collect deposit and first 2 months of rent, this process takes at least 10 days.
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### Author:  [@eggspurt](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/eggspurt)
#### Post date: [25 July 2024 05:28 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/4 "2024-07-25T05:28:10Z")
I think me and my landlord have found a trick where we jointly defeat RealPage’s algorithm. This thing is a toxic nuisance and should be eliminated one way or another.
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### Author:  [@eggspurt](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/eggspurt)
#### Post date: [14 August 2024 19:55 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/5 "2024-08-14T19:55:20Z")
> **[Argentina got rid of rent control. Housing supply skyrocketed](https://www.newsweek.com/javier-milei-rent-control-argentina-us-election-kamala-harris-housing-affordability-1938127)**
>
> The Argentine president, known for his free-market stance, repealed a law that had imposed restrictions on landlords and significantly reduced rental availability.
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### Author:  [@Enon](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Enon)
#### Post date: [17 August 2024 22:59 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/6 "2024-08-17T22:59:43Z")
From an economic point of view, rentiers are parasites. (Economists don’t care much about economics, though – it’s always ignored in favor of their real job, which is to concoct justifications for whatever crimes the people who pay them commit.) From a legal point of view, large landlords can hardly avoid racketeering charges, at least here in Georgia where the RICO statute doesn’t have the loopholes it does other places. They collude in setting unconscionable lease terms, harbor illegal aliens, regularly commit all sorts of fraud and extortion, file false documents, perjure, abuse the disabled, engage in bribery of officials and judges as well as other corruption, even prevent annexation by towns which completely surround them, thus denying their residents representation.
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### Author:  [@Citizen\_bitcoin](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Citizen_bitcoin)
#### Post date: [17 August 2024 23:08 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/7 "2024-08-17T23:08:10Z")
Does Fulton county have anti squatter laws? Is it difficult to evict a non paying tenant?
I am not defending fraud and extortion by landlords. My guess is the rental market in Atlanta is distorted by delinquent tenants and rent control laws.
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### Author:  [@Enon](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Enon)
#### Post date: [17 August 2024 23:54 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/8 "2024-08-17T23:54:44Z")
Read my [prior post](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/squatted-upon-in-america/4566/63) carefully.
There is no rent control, eviction of even paying tenants is done as a matter or course. Eviction for non-payment can be filed at any time after the rent is due, no grace period. The landlord need not accept cash or checks for payment, nor are the required to accept payment less than their demand, even if the demand is fraudulent and more than specified on the lease. Tenants must pay all rent specified on the lease even if the rental unit is uninhabitable, and even if has been completely destroyed through no fault of the tenant.
In fact, the tenant must pay all money the landlord claims into escrow in order to get a hearing, not that tenants ever win. Even if one does get a hearing, the landlord can demand and receive judgment on any arbitrary additional amount, even if the landlord doesn’t make the claim until the end of proceedings, giving the tenant no chance to defend against the claim. That additional amount must be paid immediately in order to appeal. There is no court record in Magistrate’s court, the entire case must be done over _de novo_.
Edit: Oh, and the tenant must file an answer in writing to the court within 10 days to the landlord’s complaint, or face immediate dispossession – even if they are not served, even if they are on vacation. Even if the tenant does respond, the landlord can get an immediate dispossessory warrant simply by saying that the tenant didn’t file an answer. Even if the answer is in the court’s records, the court won’t check.
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### Author:  [@Citizen\_bitcoin](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Citizen_bitcoin)
#### Post date: [18 August 2024 21:07 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/9 "2024-08-18T21:07:06Z")
Apologies for not remembering all the details from your previous post from June 2. My memory and brain are draining like my iPhone battery.
Here is California:
> **[Cash-Strapped California Inches Closer To Handing Taxpayer Home Loans To...](https://dailycaller.com/2024/08/18/california-to-give-home-loans-to-illegals/)**
>
> California lawmakers are one step closer to making hundreds of millions of taxpayer-funded home loans available to residents living in the country illegally.
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### Author:  [@civilwestman](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/civilwestman)
#### Post date: [19 August 2024 14:58 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/10 "2024-08-19T14:58:26Z")
How much will they be paid to register and vote?
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### Author:  [@Citizen\_bitcoin](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/Citizen_bitcoin)
#### Post date: [27 August 2024 01:41 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/11 "2024-08-27T01:41:40Z")
> **[Apartment complex charges a woman $15,000 for breaking her lease. She had died.](https://notthebee.com/article/apartment-complex-charges-a-woman-15000-for-breaking-her-lease-after-she-died)**
>
> The Lodge at Shavano Park apartments in San Antonio, Texas, wasn't about to let 91-year-old Sanda Bonilla out of her lease for some lame excuse like dying.
Add:
Atlanta is number 3
>
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### Author:  [@smagor](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/smagor)
#### Post date: [25 November 2025 17:39 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/12 "2025-11-25T17:39:42Z")
> [@AI Lawsuits](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/ai-lawsuits/3381/40):
>
> This is a really important case that got settled with a whimper: [https://www.wsj.com/business/justice-department-to-settle-lawsuit-over-apartment-rental-pricing-14f81b50](https://www.wsj.com/business/justice-department-to-settle-lawsuit-over-apartment-rental-pricing-14f81b50?st=8fUV44&reflink=article_copyURL_share) We can’t have functioning markets without privacy.
Thanks for the update. Has little to do with AI, but belongs with cartels and anti-trust here
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### Author:  [@smagor](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/smagor)
#### Post date: [25 November 2025 17:48 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/13 "2025-11-25T17:48:34Z")
It looks like if any customer wants to use Machine Learning (ML) provided by RealPage, they have to use their own data and run ML in their own, isolated container. No data sharing:
> **[Justice Department Requires RealPage to End the Sharing of Competitively...](https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/justice-department-requires-realpage-end-sharing-competitively-sensitive-information-and)**
>
> The Justice Department’s Antitrust Division filed a proposed settlement today to resolve the United States’ claims against RealPage Inc. as part of its ongoing enforcement against algorithmic coordination, information sharing, and other...
> Competing companies must make independent pricing decisions, and with the rise of algorithmic and artificial intelligence tools, we will remain at the forefront of vigorous antitrust enforcement,” said Assistant Attorney General Abigail Slater of the Justice Department’s Antitrust Division.
> If approved by the court, the proposed consent judgment would require RealPage to:
>
> - Cease having its software use competitors’ nonpublic, competitively sensitive information to determine rental prices in runtime operation;
> - Cease using active lease data for purposes of training the models underlying the software, limiting model training to historic or backward-looking nonpublic data that has been aged for at least 12 months;
> - Not use models that determine geographic effects narrower than at a state level, which is broader than the markets alleged in the complaint;
> - Remove or redesign features that limited price decreases or aligned pricing between competing users of the software;
> - Cease conducting market surveys to collect competitively sensitive information;
> - Refrain from discussing market analyses or trends based on nonpublic data, or pricing strategies, in RealPage meetings relating to revenue management software;
> - Accept a court-appointed monitor to ensure compliance with the terms of the consent judgment; and
> - Cooperate in the United States’ lawsuit against property management companies that have used its software.
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### Author:  [@smagor](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/smagor)
#### Post date: [26 November 2025 18:03 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/14 "2025-11-26T18:03:37Z")
It is really just a slap on the wrist, when compared to fines and jail time for price-fixing in the past. Here are just a few examples:
> **[Dutch Airline Executive Agrees to Plead Guilty for Fixing Prices on Air Cargo...](https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/pr/dutch-airline-executive-agrees-plead-guilty-fixing-prices-air-cargo-shipments)**
>
> A Dutch citizen and executive of Martinair Holland N.V. (Martinair) has agreed to plead guilty, serve time in jail and pay a criminal fine for participating in a conspiracy to fix cargo rates for international air shipments. Including todays charge,...
> **[One of the Nation’s Largest Chicken Producers Pleads Guilty to Price Fixing...](https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/pr/one-nation-s-largest-chicken-producers-pleads-guilty-price-fixing-and-sentenced-107-million)**
>
> Pilgrim’s Pride Corporation (Pilgrim’s), a major broiler chicken producer based in Greeley, Colorado, has pleaded guilty and has been sentenced to pay approximately $107 million in criminal fines for its participation in a conspiracy to fix prices...
> **[apg\_cer-report-auto-parts-appendix-a-b.pdf](https://www.morganlewis.com/~/media/files/document/apg_cer-report-auto-parts-appendix-a-b.pdf)**
>
> 419.27 KB
> **[Four Infineon Technologies Executives Agree to Plead Guilty in International...](https://www.justice.gov/archive/atr/public/press_releases/2004/206631.htm)**
> **[Samsung Executive Agrees to Plead Guilty, Serve Jail Time for Participating...](https://www.justice.gov/archive/atr/public/press_releases/2006/218462.htm)**
Whether the pricing information between competitors is exchanged at cocktail parties, backrooms or through 3rd-party ML services does not really make any difference.
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### Author:  [@jabowery](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/u/jabowery)
#### Post date: [26 November 2025 20:39 UTC](https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/t/lawsuits-mount-over-software-used-by-landlords-to-set-rents/4795/15 "2025-11-26T20:39:29Z")
Neurons discriminate. It’s just what they do. Outlaw discrimination and only outlaws will have neurons.